question about breeder

[kiragirl00]

Hi,
I am fairly new and wondered if anyone has heard of Prydwynn Dobermans? I am thinking of getting a puppy from them and just wondered.

[lewisipso]

I have not heard of them but most likely would not be in a position to. Here are a few links I was able to find via a search.
http://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1GGGE_en___US385&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=Prydwynn+Dobermans
http://www.freedoglistings.com/details.aspx?t=0&id=12893
http://www.loveofbreeds.com/directory/Dobie.html

I haven't found anything negative yet.

[Panama]

I like the lines their males are out of (personal preference). They show & health test. It appears the dam of their current litter is not OFA'd and will be 4 in March... so I would ask about that. I didn't look through any contract, so I don't know what type of health or replacement guarantee they have. The current litter on their site is quite exceptional.

[RKCM]

I agree with Pam. Some people Pinn Hip instead of OFA which I find acceptable. Very few dobermans fail on hips, thanks to the old timers.

[von Cosack Dobermann]

Did a quick check and found very little on Dobquest for pedigree research. It looks like some of their dogs are off of Brunswigs Cryptonite which was a very popular show dog and appears in many pedigrees but in my opinion I'd avoid him totally. Lack of character on many of the get from that line and to many health questions associated to that dog also. He is far behind and thats a plus, I would continue looking.
Do you have specific needs with you puppy purchase such as sport, rescue training, PP training, Sch. sport training etc.??? There are specific breeders who excell at certain needs of a buyer, definetly something to consider when searching. Von

[RKCM]

Everyone knows that Von and I see dogs a little differently.

He had quite a few puppies with longivity certificates and also many champions in conformation, WAE and performance events. There is no question many people thought he was a superior dog. There is no dog that is 100% on anything. Here is the dobequest link to his puppies:

http://dobequest.org/profile.php?DOGID=45

I would evaluate the puppy on what venue you want to do with him, talk to the breeder, and look at the pups myself. No litter is 100% on anything. Looks like crytonite is back about 6 generations....although, he was a lovely dog.

I do not this breeder by the way, just talking about the dog mentioned. He's well known.

[RKCM]

Kira, when do you get your puppy?

[prydwynn]

I rarely post to this list or any other list for that matter. I did have a notice come in my spam box. It has been so long since I have been to this list, I really forgot about it. Anyway I thought I would take look after getting the notice.

Some here have said they don't know me, so it would be hard to give out an opinion about me.

We are very proud of our dogs and our breeding program. We have worked hard in our research of bloodlines.

I do not know Kiragirl00. If you ever have any questions about our litters, our dogs, our lines, please don't hesitate to email.

Panama, you are right the last litter was exceptional.


Georgia
PrydWynn Dobermans
prydwynndobermans@yahoo.com

[RKCM]

I rarely post to this list or any other list for that matter. I did have a notice come in my spam box. It has been so long since I have been to this list, I really forgot about it. Anyway I thought I would take look after getting the notice.

Some here have said they don't know me, so it would be hard to give out an opinion about me.

We are very proud of our dogs and our breeding program. We have worked hard in our research of bloodlines.

I do not know Kiragirl00. If you ever have any questions about our litters, our dogs, our lines, please don't hesitate to email.

Panama, you are right the last litter was exceptional.


Georgia
PrydWynn Dobermans
prydwynndobermans@yahoo.com

Lovely dogs and website. Welcome to the hub......Some people go by all kinds of crazy names, I have a hard time just being me. LOL. i did notice she made that post and never came back, for what I'm not sure. Most people respond when they ask questions. OH Well....Welcome to the forum.

Sorry I didn't edit your post, just hit the wrong button. I'm a new Admin.

[prydwynn]

Lovely dogs and website. Welcome to the hub......Some people go by all kinds of crazy names, I have a hard time just being me. LOL. i did notice she made that post and never came back, for what I'm not sure. Most people respond when they ask questions. OH Well....Welcome to the forum.

Sorry I didn't edit your post, just hit the wrong button. I'm a new Admin.


Thank you, thank you, thank you.:)

I know what your saying about the crazy names.

I sort of figured she was not on my puppy list.


Georgia

[Rhiannon]

We would not hesitate to have her dogs. They breed responsibly and we have seen them at shows. They are doing things right. I have seen their dogs in action and move nice etc. They show AKC and International as well. Don't know about UKC. Georgia will do you right. My guess would be someone wanting to start things like what happens on other sites. Don't worry Georgia. The admins and mods watch out for this type of thing.

[prydwynn]

We would not hesitate to have her dogs. They breed responsibly and we have seen them at shows. They are doing things right. I have seen their dogs in action and move nice etc. They show AKC and International as well. Don't know about UKC. Georgia will do you right. My guess would be someone wanting to start things like what happens on other sites. Don't worry Georgia. The admins and mods watch out for this type of thing.

Wow, thank you.

I think the comments in general were great. I think someone had an issue maybe with Cryponite. Cryponite was a great dog. Cryponite is just in one female I have now and it is 6- 8 generations back. He is in alot of pedigrees.

What we are breeding now is almost 20 years of researching pedigrees. Then being in the right place at the right time. I am very lucky to have the dogs and pedigrees I currently have. I have alot of support behind me.

I am still learning and hoping I put into action what I have and am learning.
Then we keep our fingers crossed and say alittle prayer.

I don't do things like anybody else. I have to do right by the dogs at all times. I have to be able to sleep at night knowing my decisions effect my breeding program.

Right now my breeding program is where I want it to be. It is sound and can stand on its own merits.

Thank you again
Georgia

[Rhiannon]

And I think that is all a reputable breeder can do. When we can look at ourselves in the mirror and say we are okay with what we do. That is awesome. There are a lot of problems in the breed and we all need to work together for the common good. Keep up the good work.

[prydwynn]

Yes, we must do the best we can for the sake of our breed. When planning a breeding, we must use any and all tools available. This breed is in trouble and we cannot bury our heads in the ground.

I forgot in my last post, I don't do UKC since we moved as there very few shows back this way. Course I heard Purina Farms had one not long ago. Hopefully they will have them again next year.

[von Cosack Dobermann]

The cryptonite hater would be ME!!!! Not only was his shoulder overdone he passed it on hahahaha!!!! A terrible out of balanced look!!!! Not the best of heads as proven with his glorified grandson cactus cash the ultimate bitch looking male!!!! Both of these animals were over used because of their success in the exhibitor ring. No one could see that the weak heads and over done shoulders were a weakness???? Couple that with using Luthor in the backlines and you add the over angulated rears that so many dogs show these days, sorta of a dog and a half!!!!

This is a perfect example of why I stress to all Dobermann owners to learn and study the Standard, not take a judges or organizations ruling on a dog when it becomes an individuals interpertation of the Standard. Both of these dogs were over used and to a point of a negative contribution when cyrpto could have passed a good shoulder to a bitch or lined that otherwize was quality. Proper decisions on how to use a dog was not taken into consideration with these animals they simply were the "Hot Dogs" at the time so breeders jumped on the band wagon and the owners of these dogs accepted the stud fees willingly. If they were "great" dogs they were still over used!!!!! Cactus Cash in the States and Gino Gomez in Europe were the most bred Dobermanns that I know of and neither was a great dog. Abit of greed and lack of knowledge dictated the results then, hopefully the new breeders will honor the Standard and not follow a popularity contest thats based on shallow opinions and not to breed one dog to a ridiculous extent. Dinners ready! Von

[RKCM]

A dog that is that far back in a pedigree has little impact on this breeders dogs. I think that there are good and bad things in every dog, none are perfect.

I haven't bred my dobermans often and they are a new breed for me. My only breed now, but it is much harder to be a breeder than to fault one. I think the breeder that was asked about has about 30 years of experience and much to offer this forum in her success in dogs. Her website and success is clear.

[Shadowlands]

I wouldn't normally step in here but you are directly insulting someones dogs and no one likes to see or hear that. Von you can have some really good points but when you come across like it is only your way, only your ideas and everyone else is wrong and all other dobes are not worth looking at, everyone tunes you out. And that is unfortunate because you do have experience and you do have some really good points that should be shared with everyone.
I am sorry for butting in on this thread.

[prydwynn]

I was not referring to Von Cosack Dobermann in my statement of Cryponite. Right or wrong it is his opinion. Course I did not ask for it. So given that......

I did not breed to Cryponite. It maybe in one of my pedigrees on one of my bitches, 6 or more generations back. The bitch that carries Cryponite has a lovely shoulder layback and a beautiful headpiece. She and the Stud used for my litter passed on both correct shoulder layback and beautiful heads.

I have spent years studying and learning the Doberman Standard. That is where I aim my breeding program at.

I guess I don't have to worry about you wanting a puppy from me from that one bitch then?

Georgia

[prydwynn]

Oh I take that back. Von Cosack did make the statement about Cryponite early.
No matter!

He does not know me or my dogs. Nor does he know what I am doing with my breeding program.

I don't live in the pass with my pedigrees, I aim for the future. I deal with the pedigrees I have.

Georgia

[Shadowlands]

I for one am glad you are here on DH. Just checked out your site and that last litter is extraordinary! Their new 'parents' are very lucky. :)

[von Cosack Dobermann]

Very defensive considering the fact that I said the dog in question was far back in the pedigree. I said NOTHING about your current dogs but when I see crypto I run because theres health problems in that line long before him. The dogs before him I know personally and the questions I raise now were raised then and they continued to breed the line.
It never fails that when hard questions are posed on these forums people get defensive about dogs they never had seen, owned or showed. Because that dog is in just about everyones line everyone gets nuts. Well we all have Dictator in the American lines and alot of the health issues goes back to him................so am I now critizing Peggy Adamson?????
The OP asked about pups and you normally look at the pedigree, I did, saw the dog in question and my advice is to look some were else. If you prydwyn take that as an insult I'm sorry I didn't realize you were cryptos breeder. Looks can fade in a pedigree and hopefully health issues become less promient but my opinion is mine it just seems when I voice mine people get panicked and think I'm attacking someone. I have the solution for this situation and we'll see if it helps. Von

[RKCM]

Can anyone name a dog that has no Cardio behind them? I think that is the problem is DMC is in all lines, no matter their origin.

Not everyone agrees with you on your opinion of those two dogs. I saw both in the ring too and they were magnificent. Breathtaking in my opinion........

The breeders back in those days did not have the tools we have today. We live with what we have at this point and we test our dogs to do the best we can. There are no clear answers even now.

Health is vital to this breed, but even when you have generations of longvity in your line, it happens. Both of these dogs in question lived to 8.5 and 9.5....not long enough but better than even some today. That's why we test....and pray. The breeder in question tests her dogs and is successful in doing something with her dogs.......much better than people that don't.

Nothing personal, just that your opinion is not mine.

[Rhiannon]

Von how are you doing....better I hope.....boy life can sure throw us some amazing curves doesn't it. I know I finally feel like my life can get back on track.....our son's truck accident was horrific and had our life in turmoil to say the least. I am glad to see you back on and posting.....I am thankful that he is going to be fine and glad that you are better. Hopefully you will not mind me asking what kind of a solution you have in mind. I would love to hear about it. I know that I have some opinions about Cardio and vWD.....would be very interesting to see where this theory goes. I have read an article on this as well. I think this is a problem we see in dogs, cats, or horses and cows whatever people are showing. Everyone jumps on the popular winning animal of the moment and then the problems begin....and in my most humble opinion sometimes it is a good five or six years before these problems really start surfacing. I know it has been a problem in show horses.

[prydwynn]

I for one am glad you are here on DH. Just checked out your site and that last litter is extraordinary! Their new 'parents' are very lucky. :)

Thank you for all that you said. I will post one of the male puppies from that litter that is a true knockout. We will be repeating that breeding again.

I am not so closed minded to throw out a bitch with Kafka in it 6-8 plus generations back.:)

Just throwing this out there:

As to Cryponite, many pedigrees have him in them. Good or bad, right or wrong. He had his good qualities and his faults. I never saw him in person, but he looks to have a nice head. Yes shoulder layback is alittle straight.

How do you judge him by today's standard or can you? What dog today meets the standard the closest in your opinion?

[prydwynn]

Very defensive considering the fact that I said the dog in question was far back in the pedigree. I said NOTHING about your current dogs but when I see crypto I run because theres health problems in that line long before him. The dogs before him I know personally and the questions I raise now were raised then and they continued to breed the line.
It never fails that when hard questions are posed on these forums people get defensive about dogs they never had seen, owned or showed. Because that dog is in just about everyones line everyone gets nuts. Well we all have Dictator in the American lines and alot of the health issues goes back to him................so am I now critizing Peggy Adamson?????
The OP asked about pups and you normally look at the pedigree, I did, saw the dog in question and my advice is to look some were else. If you prydwyn take that as an insult I'm sorry I didn't realize you were cryptos breeder. Looks can fade in a pedigree and hopefully health issues become less promient but my opinion is mine it just seems when I voice mine people get panicked and think I'm attacking someone. I have the solution for this situation and we'll see if it helps. Von

Oh please don't read my reply as defensive. Your advice to the OP was to continue looking. You did make a judgement on my dog's and their offspring because of one dog many generations back. I just thought your advice alittle narrow. I did not feel you were attacking nor was I panicked. I don't scare that easy. My dogs and their pedigree can stand on their own merits.

No I am not Kafka breeder, yes you are entitled to your opinion.

[Shadowlands]

You call only one a knockout? Wow, must be a stunning little man. Would love to see a pic for sure. :)

Correct me if I am wrong, and I am not refering to Cryptonite specifically, but don't you assess both dam and sire when contemplating a mating? You never have two perfect specimens, there is always something to be improved in all of our dogs. So if the get out of Crypto was of poor form, you must also look to the dam. Poor breeding is just that, regardless of whether the sire is exceptional or not. You can't put Beauty and the Beast together and expect all Beauties to be the result. I also think that it is easy to criticize in hindsight. Breeders look at what the sire and the dam offer the breed individually and what will be improved with each pairing. It is not an exact science but experience and previous progeny do give acceptable ideas of what can be expected.

Just my two cents worth. :)

[prydwynn]

Oh no, the whole litter is great and doing wonderful. The boys were all so close in structure, it came down to the "IT" factor. If you have ever seen "IT", you know what I am talking about. This litter knocked my socks off. I was lucky to have "IT" with Justin. He could just stand there and draw your eye. He loves to show. He thought everyone came to the show just to pet him. He is easy to live with. He produces nicely. That is what this boy, Rio is going to do(Hopefully).
One of the girls in the litter is staying with me to show, then will go to her home. She is gorgeous.

Shadowlands you are oh so right, it takes two to tango. There is a check list to go thru before a breeding takes place, at least there is for me. If trying to correct faults, you look to find correct in the mate. If trying to improve in any area, the other better have it. If we had perfect that would be easy.
Do the research, look at other progeny, check the pedigree on both. Then cross your fingers.
Each breeding we do, we better improve something, structure, health, attitude, something. If you have mediocre, that is what you will get.

Now with this new DCM test, we have swabbed ours and are waiting to hear.

[Shadowlands]

I know what you mean when you say the "IT" factor...the Stallion...the one that just oozes confidence and pride just by being them. Yep, they are the one you notice above all others, even from across the room. Totally know what you mean.

I look forward to seeing pictures of this young man. :)

[RKCM]

Here is the link to the dogs Von is speaking of:

http://www.cambriadobes.com/


They have many dogs that are on the longivity list, and like all lines, some that don't.

Check it out for yourself.

[prydwynn]

I know what you mean when you say the "IT" factor...the Stallion...the one that just oozes confidence and pride just by being them. Yep, they are the one you notice above all others, even from across the room. Totally know what you mean.

I look forward to seeing pictures of this young man. :)

Confident in their own skin, as a friend of mine says.:)

[prydwynn]

Hope I did this right but here is Rio, PrydWynn's All My Life. He is 14 weeks in this picture.

I have more in my profile.

[RKCM]

Pretty puppy, Georgia. Best Wishes for him in the future. Love the name.

[prydwynn]

Pretty puppy, Georgia. Best Wishes for him in the future. Love the name.

Thank you

[Shadowlands]

Wow. Here is my name and number if you are doing a repeat breeding in the future! Holy crap! I'll take a male, show quality...cookie cutter of this little guy. :)
Gorgeous...and so young for such confidence...carries himself superbly...love the face.
He is going to be a knock out once he is matured. :)

[Shadowlands]

Just checked out your album. Beautiful pics. Your red male, Score, is gorgeous.
Look forward to seeing more pics as that young Rio matures. :)

[prydwynn]

Wow. Here is my name and number if you are doing a repeat breeding in the future! Holy crap! I'll take a male, show quality...cookie cutter of this little guy. :)
Gorgeous...and so young for such confidence...carries himself superbly...love the face.
He is going to be a knock out once he is matured. :)

Are you saying we did good then???? :)

I really wanted to keep him but figured in the home he was get he would do better there.

The whole litter graded out show. Now really, that does not happen.....I graded and I had 3 other breeders grade the litter.

Like I said I have done my research and I have a wonderful support system behind him. I consider myself lucky. It is a lot of work, sweat, tears, heartache but if you are stubborn and don't give up hopefully one day it pays off.

My payoff was this last litter. :)

[Shadowlands]

Yes, I am saying you did good. :) Like there was really any question on my response. LOL!
I would agree with this last litter being your payoff. They do look fantastic. :D

[Rhiannon]

Confident in their own skin, as a friend of mine says.:)

I love that quote and that certainly is a great definition of IT. Beautiful litter and our daughter has always loved Justin.

[Rhiannon]

Hope I did this right but here is Rio, PrydWynn's All My Life. He is 14 weeks in this picture.

I have more in my profile.

Great name for a beautiful dog.

[prydwynn]

I love that quote and that certainly is a great definition of IT. Beautiful litter and our daughter has always loved Justin.

Thank you.

Justin had his little fan club while he was showing. He is a ham. Never would guess he was a rescue.

After we got his AKC championship, I took him to the International shows(IABAC) mainly because he loves showing. He took 3 BIS and 1 BIS reserve.

Justin is a trip.

[prydwynn]

Great name for a beautiful dog.

My husband loves Conway Twitty songs. So that litter was a Conway Twitty theme.

Wait til the next litter. We have some great names for that one.

[prydwynn]

That should have been "Comfortable in his/her skin". Confident works, too.

[Rhiannon]

Again I always find it so interesting that usually these OPs post and run and never come back to at least add any more to the thread but maybe they get their kicks just seeing what they get stirred up. In my most honest humble opinion a real person sincerely wanting to know valid answers would stick around and add more to the thread. Just saying.....looks extremely strange to me why that is the one and only post the original OP puts out there.

[Hall's Dobes]

Hi All,
Nice to see new people joining up after being away so long(Sorry).Not got an opinon on the arguement so i am staying out of it,but yes beautiful dogs indeed. But then again they are not Hall's Dobes as everyone sees there own as special don't they? Welcome once again.:D
Chris
Vier, Super Dobe
Iggy, Super snoozer
Jazz, Elegant girl
Purdey,The Hurricane.

[Hall's Dobes]

Oh just to add from the Englishman..Who the Hell is Conway Twitty?:confused: Sounds like something you stick on a roadsign?STOP BE CAREFULL TWITTY AHEAD!!:D
Sorry but give me John Lennon anytime!:D

[Shadowlands]

Chris, it is a good thing you are so far away...I would have to kick your butt just for you being you. Conway Twitty is a country singer. :D

[Hall's Dobes]

Well i didnt know did i?? Never heard of him! The only country sounds we hear over here are the ones like erm erm erm oh yeah Dolly Parton,Tammy Winnette,Billy Jo Spears so thats about it! Sorry !

[RKCM]

Chris, now I know you know Oklahoma's Carrie Underwood or how about Faith Hill, and Toby Keith....just of few of our home state country folks.

[prydwynn]

If there was an argument, I missed it.....:) I never took any of what was said as "fighting words". I mean really to get upset over anything that was said, not really worth the effort. There were opinions offered and advice given.

I myself try to be very careful in the advice or opinions I give because you just don't know who you are really speaking to on these list.

Now for the "Who is Conway Twitty" comment, those might be fighting words to my husband. ;) Not really, he said laughed.


Georgia

[okiegirl]

who is Billy Jo Spears?

[RKCM]

I don't have a clue, Okie, but hope it's a good breeder. LOL.

Here is one of my favorites by Carrie Underwood:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-nng3821YU

Remember our rescues and our people locally. Time or Money, it's all needed across the world.

R we off topic or what? LOL

[Rhiannon]

who is Billy Jo Spears?

LOL thanks for asking I was sitting here wondering the same exact thing. Glad that I am not the only one who has no clue who that is. :D

[Hall's Dobes]

Oh she was from ages back.It used to be one of my dads faves,he was a country person,just didnt rub off on me. I think it had something to do with him singing along to it out of key,he thought it was funny till one day the dobe started howling along to it,now that was funny!:D

[Rhiannon]

Thanks I had no clue....I do know Garth Brooks and Faith Hill and George Strait, Kenny Chesney and Shania Twain......LOL. One of the country stars has a Weimaraner that I know of just don't remember who. Speaking of stars I did just see where Kelly Osborne just got a blue doberman from her brother that is being trained for protection.

[RKCM]

Thanks I had no clue....I do know Garth Brooks and Faith Hill and George Strait, Kenny Chesney and Shania Twain......LOL. One of the country stars has a Weimaraner that I know of just don't remember who. Speaking of stars I did just see where Kelly Osborne just got a blue doberman from her brother that is being trained for protection.

Garth lives in Oklahoma......not sure maybe Faith Hill too...Never heard of Hall's girl. I love Alan Jackson, think he's an Alabama boy.

[Hall's Dobes]

See country music here is vitually non exsistant,we get the odd one coming through like the Dixie chicks and stuff but not a lot! I know its very popular there,it just does not sell here! But i am sure you lot are going to educate me in Country!...............Now where did i put my stetson and cowboy boots?Yeehaa!:D

[von Cosack Dobermann]

WOW this thread took a turn!!!!!! As far as country music? as far away as possible!!!! Boring as ever, same bass guitar line in every song and if you've heard one truck song with a misunderstand bf//gf and a lost dog near a RR track I'll throw up hahaha!!!!
If you want to hear a great Conway song find "Rainy Night in Georgia" with the great Sam Moore (from Sam & Dave) singing with him. One of the best versions of a great song. (mostly because of Sam) but Conways ok. Von

[Panama]

One of the country stars has a Weimaraner that I know of just don't remember who.

Aaron Tippin' has a Weimaraner!

[Hall's Dobes]

WOW this thread took a turn!!!!!! As far as country music? as far away as possible!!!! Boring as ever, same bass guitar line in every song and if you've heard one truck song with a misunderstand bf//gf and a lost dog near a RR track I'll throw up hahaha!!!!
If you want to hear a great Conway song find "Rainy Night in Georgia" with the great Sam Moore (from Sam & Dave) singing with him. One of the best versions of a great song. (mostly because of Sam) but Conways ok. Von
I am with you on that one VON!;)