Top Line

[Panama]

I can understand a solid topline (little to no movement when in motion), but I just don't understand why some refer to it as LEVEL.

If the topline is suppose to be "LEVEL" I guess the photos used in the DPCA Illustrated Standard are incorrect them. Having trouble with my photobucket.

If you copy the picture of the Ideal Male & Ideal female, draw a LEVEL line from the withers to the croup area, the line is well above the dog's back.

If you draw a LEVEL line from the bottom of the withers where the "back" starts to the croup area, the line still isn't touching the dog.

If you draw a STRAIGHT line from the BACK to the croup, it lays right on the dog's back, however, it isn't LEVEL.

I'll try to get the Illustrated pics posted.

[Panama]

Top red line is LEVEL from withers to croup area
Bottom red line is STRAIGHT line from back to croup (not level)
Green line is Level from BACK to croup

http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u223/Pan_D_bear/Topline.jpg

Neither of the LEVEL lines touch the dog's back.

[Panama]

Yes Becky, thank you for clarifying what the standard actually says.

No harm to those of us that might fully understand what she meant. However there are others that do visit this forum, and a lot of people that are new to the breed.

Say "level" to a carpenter or someone that works in an art gallery, then tell them to look at their dog's topline!

I've heard "level" use with Yorkies. Seeing a stacked Yorkie, it's obvious why. Level in reference to a Dobe's topline is seen when gaiting. Level would be that the back doesn't roll.

[RKCM]

Sometimes we get slammed for using the word level, but it is just another way to say it. IT isn't exact though and why I corrected that. The standard is the actual wording. Much easier to see a dog with an incorrect topline and even easier when you compare correct to incorrect. Usually when there is something incorrect with the topline it is caused by other faults in structure. I do agree with that.

[nterry]

Toplines are hard to explain without pictures. Maybe Logan will post her bitch again that we evaluated so we can show you. She had some good and bad points. I thought her topline was fine. Her front was not the best, but all dogs have faults. Sure don't want a roach! LOL.

A handler can correct a topline with stacking and expert hands. In movement it is seen clearly. Sometimes the topline is so bad that it can't be correctly. Sometimes judges ask that the handlers not stack the dogs and have a loose lead, when they do it is very telling.

The illustrated standard is a good tool but it isn't perfect. The best suggestion for you Panama is to go to some of the seminars offered by the DPCA and study toplines. There is nothing like hands on the dog and getting to compare what is correct and what is not. Pictures are only one tool and aren't without problems, as you have pointed out. Read and memorize the standard and knowing how to apply it takes many years. Toplines are related to a number of other problems in structure and a very telling clue to proper structure.

Until you understand basic structure, you should not be breeding but then it is a life long experience. It is when you know it all, you realize what you don't know what you thought you knew. Someone said that and it gave me a laugh because it is so true.

[Panama]

I am well aware of the Standard and basic structure. I try to use the photos in describing a particular physical/structural trait so those that are not aware of what we are talking about can actually see what the discussion is about.