Canine good citizen test

[jelly8bean]

Anyone done one on their dobie? I've got it on my rottie and working for it on Indigo so we can do agility (I hope). It is not too hard and I think it is very worthwhile for everyone. Here is the link describing it..

http://www.akc.org/events/cgc/training_testing.cfm

My local training club offers it for $10 per pet, or free if your dog is in one of their classes.

[DynamicDuo]

My 2 yr old, Samantha, is in Obedience classes and we have a CGC test scheduled for the end of Feb. I'll let you know how she does. I hope to compete in Rally in the future and also use Samantha as a therapy dog too.

[jelly8bean]

Very cool, glad we have another person interested in the working dog. I have heard Rally is the bridge between CGC and full blown obedience. I like Rally, and I'm doing that with my rottie. (though we have had a setback with knee surgery for her). I hope to get Indigo's CGC in Feb as well. She has some issue with other dogs though. Not aggressive but barking. That part where you shake hands with a person who has the neutral dog may be too much for her at this point. I'm working on it. She is great in classes with other dogs, but that first time she sees them.. well we have to work some more on that.

If you are interested in Rally I'm on a Yahoo group just for Rally discussions. It is a great source of detailed training information, as well as interpretations of the requirements.

[SnuzerDog]

Hope to do this soon with Deano. Finished his basic obedience in December, and am planning on joining a local all-breed training club (kind of a co-op type org) that seems very well organized and has a lengthy history. They offer several levels of beginning through advanced training, then also have agility, conformation and some specialty classes. They do also certify for AKC/CGC so that's the direction I want to go. Looking forward to it! :D

[Slaboflab]

It is definitely good to have, both my labs have it.

[jelly8bean]

I'm getting Indigo ready for the CGC in the first week of March. Her loose leash is pretty good, the stays are getting very good. But I need to work on her dog to dog stuff. I'm trying to get her to petsmart at least once a week to improve on her handling.. but with the winter weather we don't walk as far, and we don't meet other dogs when walking. Any other things you all can think of to prep this part?

[SnuzerDog]

It's pretty tough in the winter the way people hole up when it gets cold. Personally, I prefer to treat winter as just another season to have fun, just in different ways. The outdoorsman in me also enjoys the differences in landscape, fauna & flora, and even the air! The forty-something in me, however, despises the icy sidewalks and surprise break-dancing sessions... :mad::D

But, I am committed to walking for an 50-80 minutes every night, and 20-30 each morning, with Deano. I bundle him up with coat, warmer and boots for the colder nights, but unfortunately we rarely run into any other dogs. Mornings and late afternoons (my wife does a quick 10 min spin with him when she gets home) are more likely times for dog to dog interaction opportunities. I was quite proud of Deano this morning when we ran into the neighbors and their two dogs, one of which is a very excitable (but well meaning) pit bull. Deano has reacted poorly in the past to this particular dog, but this morning kept it in check with just a quick growl that he quickly silenced with a word from me. The pit bull on the other hand, pulled my poor neighbor off his feet on the ice and would not calm down; his wife was not pleased with their pup's behavior, either. We do also have several dogs in fenced yards backing up to our alley that give us opportunities for training, but sadly, at this time of year that's about it.

I was just looking last night at the local All-Breed Dog Club's class schedule; think I'll get Deano signed up for advanced beginners, and then do the CGC after that...

Can't wait for the warmer temps to arrive and the ice to disappear! Looks like we might get a taste of the 40's in the next few days... :)

[jelly8bean]

I'm with you.. warmer will be so much better. I have a nice backyard for them to run around in for added exercise. She is improving. I'm using clicker training on this meeting other dogs stuff. I guess I just need to dedicate myself to at least an hour a week in Petsmart, that seems to be the only place I can find other dogs, my only worry is that the one's in petsmart are not always under control. But I guess I can avoid those situations and hopefully improve her skills on leash.

[tidibole]

Anyone done one on their dobie? I've got it on my rottie and working for it on Indigo so we can do agility (I hope). It is not too hard and I think it is very worthwhile for everyone. Here is the link describing it..

http://www.akc.org/events/cgc/training_testing.cfm

My local training club offers it for $10 per pet, or free if your dog is in one of their classes.I have CGCs on most of my dogs. The test actually differs to intrepatation of the tester. I have had some tests that have included a number of obstacles, walkers, wheel chairs, grocery carts with cans making very loud noises, children eating hot dogs as the dog is requested to mill in a crowd, etc. Some of the tests have actually crossed over to the TDI portion. Some have been so simple that I saw no benefit in acquiring the title. I recently lost my 9 1/2 year RESCUE male who had aTDI..and probably the most SOLID temperemt I have ever seen and he started with a very TOUGH CGC test which I feel not only benefited him but also gave me a very good idea of where we were headed. I also have a YOUNG Euro dog that unfortunately flunked the first time, very squirelly. But will try again later! I feel not only the test to be a viable example of the dogs temperemnt and attitude but a true benefit with people who are unaware of the dog...I recommend it to anyone regardless of breed, even crosses are eligible for this AKC title!!!

[Dobs4ever]

I am a certified CGC evaluator and there are a series of 10 areas that the dog is tested in. Each evaluator has the liberty to choose how they present the stressor or challenge to the dog. It is not written stone that this any area must be presented in a particular way. But in some there is just ot a lot of creativity you can use for example the 3 minute owner out of site and leaving the dog with a neutral person.

FYI the CGC is not a title it is a certification stating that your dog has met the miniumum requirements and is a canine good citizen. It is definitely a great place to start and jump kicks many folks into full obedience which is a blast.

[tidibole]

I am a certified CGC evaluator and there are a series of 10 areas that the dog is tested in. Each evaluator has the liberty to choose how they present the stressor or challenge to the dog. It is not written stone that this any area must be presented in a particular way. But in some there is just ot a lot of creativity you can use for example the 3 minute owner out of site and leaving the dog with a neutral person.

FYI the CGC is not a title it is a certification stating that your dog has met the miniumum requirements and is a canine good citizen. It is definitely a great place to start and jump kicks many folks into full obedience which is a blast.I consider it a TITLE in the sense that is positioned after the name of the dog in conjunction with additional AKC titles...i.e, CGC, CDX, TDI, etc..

[Dobs4ever]

I have done CGC's on 5 Dobes. Not all mine as I have a couple clients that I trained and did on their dobes.

[jelly8bean]

I always understood it to be a certification (like CPA)... and it is the spring board into dog sports. The most well traveled levels are CGC, rally titles, obediance titles. In my area a CGC is a basic requirement to be able to participate in agility training etc. I think it is a good baseline of behavior.

[tidibole]

I always understood it to be a certification (like CPA)... and it is the spring board into dog sports. The most well traveled levels are CGC, rally titles, obediance titles. In my area a CGC is a basic requirement to be able to participate in agility training etc. I think it is a good baseline of behavior.
You are absolutely correct and I do stand corrected by Dobes4ever. It is a certification per say however, as is mentioned the springboard to much more. It is also required before the Therapy Dog CERTIFICATION. I was also informed the WAE/WAC is also a certification. AND that is what is wonderful about TRUE educational forums, EVERYONE WINS!!!!!

[jelly8bean]

Yeah! Now lets go certify some doggies! :)
(I have to wait till after Indigo is over the heartworm treatement, then we can get back on track to get our CGC this summer).

[Dobs4ever]

That is correct Jellybean - the WAC, ATT, ATTS are all evaluations of the temperament and are considered a test and are not considered titles. But they are a vital part of any program and for those who get the CGC are not that far off from a CD. It is a great stepping stone.

[tidibole]

Yeah! Now lets go certify some doggies! :)
(I have to wait till after Indigo is over the heartworm treatement, then we can get back on track to get our CGC this summer).
Another perhaps not so well known fact: There are NO age requirements for the CGC. A puppy must be old enough to receive a Rabies inoculation, which can be given as early as 4 months. I was on a website and I cannot remember BUT it was stated that one of their puppies had obtained the CERTIFICATION at the tender age of 4 months. So of course I had to check. I personally think that there are too many aspects of the test that could not reasonably validate the temperment at that age. Even at AKC events i.e. obedience, conformation, etc. A puppy must be 6 months old.

[RKCM]

A CGC is an easier test to do than putting on a CD or Rally title. Our three dogs have CGC since we do therapy with them. They are still working on obedience. It takes a lot of time to get the automatic sit. I'm waiting for warmer weather too.

Becky

[tidibole]

A CGC is an easier test to do than putting on a CD or Rally title. Our three dogs have CGC since we do therapy with them. They are still working on obedience. It takes a lot of time to get the automatic sit. I'm waiting for warmer weather too.

BeckyMy first CGC evaluation was given May 22, 1994. Back then they were NEW and as a result rather strict. Since then I have taken many more with some being essentially sloppy and really worthless and some have crossed over to TDI...I had a TDI dog until several months ago when he passed of Bone Cancer. The automatic sit is not as difficult as you may think BUT the positioning, quickness and strightness of that sit can be a problem. I randomly work with my dog in the kitchen to proof the sit. As you are probably aware there are definite rules concerning the positioning to ones leg when in the ring. there are many good DVD, etc available from different trainers that have invaluable tips to obtain that "quick pop sit"...dobs4ever also trains... and has a wealth of infornmation and expereince that she is more than willing to share

[SnuzerDog]

...there are many good DVD, etc available from different trainers that have invaluable tips to obtain that "quick pop sit"...dobs4ever also trains... and has a wealth of infornmation and expereince that she is more than willing to share

Any chance one of you fine folks could share a link or recommend a title or two??? Really like the DVD's especially, as you can see exactly what the end result is, and sometimes how it is attained. Thanks! :)

[Dobs4ever]

SnuzerDog - Not sure if this is what you are asking but many of the titles go in ascending order. In other words you have to have one before you can get the other. For example if you are doing basic AKC obedience you have to start with a CD, then go to CDX, then utility which is the highest level. In Schutzhund you have to have a BH before you can do any titles at all. No BH, No tracking, No obedience, No Schutzhund. Schutzhund is considered a marathon for the dog and designed to test his willingness to work and obey his handler, the heart to complete the job at hand which a Sch I dog must pass an obedience exercise, tracking exercise and the protection exercise all in the same weekend and the courage to engage the aggressor. A truly beautiful event to watch. In fact our UDC Nationals is next week here in Missouri and I always love to see the dogs working as they were bred to do.

[SnuzerDog]

SnuzerDog - Not sure if this is what you are asking but many of the titles go in ascending order. In other words you have to have one before you can get the other. For example if you are doing basic AKC obedience you have to start with a CD, then go to CDX, then utility which is the highest level. In Schutzhund you have to have a BH before you can do any titles at all. No BH, No tracking, No obedience, No Schutzhund. Schutzhund is considered a marathon for the dog and designed to test his willingness to work and obey his handler, the heart to complete the job at hand which a Sch I dog must pass an obedience exercise, tracking exercise and the protection exercise all in the same weekend and the courage to engage the aggressor. A truly beautiful event to watch. In fact our UDC Nationals is next week here in Missouri and I always love to see the dogs working as they were bred to do.

Ohhh... no, sorry! Meant reference information on the CGC- perhaps a DVD title (as in name) that shows a dog and handler taking the test, or training for it. Or, links to any websites with embedded videos or text aimed specifically at the CGC requirements and performance. Being a guy, the visual stuff is easiest for me to digest... :D

With that said, thanks for the info you posted. I have only had my rescue dobe Deano for about six months and am soaking up as much breed and training knowledge as I can get my brain around. Wish I were a bit closer to Mizzou, I'd come out to watch the trials- perhaps there will be some in Ohio sometime this summer??? I am finding this new world (of dogs and training) fascinating. :)

[jelly8bean]

Snuzer.. I certainly do not have the levels of training that others on the forum have put on their dogs, but the CGC is really pretty straight forward, I believe you have already been working on loose leash walking, and your sits, downs and stays are ok? That is 80 percent of the test. Go to the AKC site and you can find a detailed description of the 10 required items to pass, and you can search on when/where tests will be offered or training clubs as well. Then it kind of depends on the route you want to go with your training. I have a nice yahoo board for Rally obedience and I am thinking about getting one of those books "click your way to Rally obedience". You could google schutzhund or the DPCA and wander around those websites and see if you can find something near you to go and check it out. I am fortunate that I have a decent training group near me and shows about 3 times per year within 20 miles. I have thought about making a longer drive to go to a schutzhund club and check them out.. but not really moving that way with my girls.

[tidibole]

SNUZER.....As JellyBean indicated ...It is straight forward and if you have a well mannered dog it takes very little to achieve the CERTIFICATION. There are however, a few exercises that could create a problem for a dog that is not as social as perhaps needed. The 10 basic exercises are as:
1. Accepting a Friendly Stranger..dog must behave while you shake and converse, no jumping, playing, etc...
2. Sitting Politely for Petting..this can be a challenge if you have an over exuberant dog...but again basic manners, or a dog that is TOO shy
3. Appearance and Grooming..essentially a vet visit and examination and or groomer Hopefully the dog responds quietly to being handled
4. Out for a Walk...Basic heeling skills to include turns (not necessarily heeling but no pulling, dragging etc)
5. Walking through a crowd..Just as stated without dog becoming obnoxious and jumping, etc I have even had the test include chilldren eating, which again can be a challenge for the dog inclined to be thief or loose his attention, but as mentioned it all boils down to good basic house manners
6. Sit/Down on command..Self explanatory also an exercise for obedience..on either command of your choice you must leave the dog to the end of a 20' leash and returns (apparently there can be no force whatsoever to make dog sit or down)Can be either a verbal or a hand signal
7.Coming when called...Simple... at end of the 20' leash but the handler need only be 10' away from dog and is called. I would recommend a nice sit and make sure that he is not too exuberant in the return resulting in unwanted jumping
8. Reaction to another Dog...This one was particularly tricky for me..this varies to the degree that some testers want the dog sitting at your side while another individual also has a dog, pleasantries are exchanged with the dog showing interest but again control and basic manners play the larger part
9. Reaction to Distractions..Interesting enough my distraction at the last test was simply a cast iron skillet being dropped on the floor about 10' behind the dog..and although startled is okay he must regain his composure without panic or any signs of aggression
10.supervosed Separation....Whoops this was almost my flunking point...Seems that I also have a mama's boy and although he was tolerant of the exercise appeared to be a bit concerned the handler leaves the dog with another person OUT OF SIGHT on a leash for 3 min...Whining crying and barking are not acceptable but are up to the descretion of the evaluator. This is also an exercise that will be utilized in advanced obedience.

Most of what is done at these tests again is nothing more than hopefully the way we would want our dogs to behave not only at home but also in social situations. But also as mentioned the degree of the testing and intrepatation of the results are left entirely to the evaluator using the above guidelines. That is why I have said that some evaluators have crossed over to the TDI testing and others are entirely to lax..Good luck...you will enjoy it!!!

[SnuzerDog]

Jelly, Tidi, thanks for the informative replies, you guys are a wealth! :) I think this will be something for Deano and I to aspire to; as I have noted here or in other threads, Deano is a rescue and while we have only been together six months I feel it has been a good six months for us both with regard to learning and training.
He has a great temperament in my opinion, but still has issues with fearfulness, although it seems to be slowly but steadily fading. Loud noises are still a problem; if someone dropped a cast iron skillet behind him I am quite sure he would come out of his skin. This, too, is getting better as we can now walk down busy streets with buses, trucks, loud exhausts, air brakes and the like without any trouble (big problem at first), but realistically can I expect him to overcome all his fears and reactions enough to pass? I guess the only way to find out is to keep practicing and try. He warms up to women very quickly, but is very hesitant around strange men. He is very complacent with small children; with other dogs, he is usually good/interested/curious, but it depends on the other dog's demeanor to a great extent- aggressive/OC behavior is not received well- and I am amazed at the number of other dogs we meet on walks that seem to have little or no socialization. Lately I have taken to sitting him while other dogs/owners pass, and he will sit very well for this, but if we walk past I will have to pull him back at least 50% of the time. Just the other day we were walking down the street, and came upon a family returning from a trip. The kids had opened the car door and the dog of course was running around the sidewalk loose; I crossed to the other side of the street in hopes that we wouldn't be noticed but of course that was not to be. There was an initial growling between the two as the other dog came running across the street, so I sat Deano and watched the other dog closely to make sure there was only polite sniffing; this all the while the mother was panicing and screeching at their dog. I have to hand it to Deano, he handled it better than I probably would've if I'd been him! :o The father was very apologetic, and I don't think their dog was really ever a threat, but it sure pointed up the need for control and manners in dogs.
At any rate, I think he's doing well, and I'm looking forward to the warmer, milder months to spend more evening time working on all of these behaviors that are required for the CGC, but I am thinking it will take us some time to master them. I'm glad that he is so well-mannered to start with, at least!

[jelly8bean]

You are doing so great with Deano. If he is Ok with air brakes he should be fine for the startle testing. We had an umbrella popped open behind my rottie. But she is very mellow. They can start at it and be interested, but not lose their minds. On meeting other dogs you have progressed wonderfully, it sounds like. Poor Indigo has been so cooped up with the heartworm treatment I may have to start all over again. The "other dog" is supposed to be a neutral dog, usually one of the trainers well trained obedience dogs. My group had us sit and stay our dog, shake hands - then briskly walk on (releasing the stay). We will have to see how things go when we get back to walking in about 2 weeks. On the supervised separation, think leaving at the groomer, the vet tech takes away, or leaving at the kennel. Not really supposed to be a big deal. Geez.. I 've had Indigo a year and we are not at our CGC level yet... but then who cares? It is a stepping stone goal, then we will do our Agility stuff (with some obedience thrown in)! She is young and we have plenty of time, and it is only for our enjoyment and bonding.

I'm glad to hear you and Deano have come so far. :)

[SnuzerDog]

A big part of my learning curve has been understanding that training takes patience, repetition and positive attitude. I have been trying to work myself into the attitude of steady, consistent, relaxed, not-in-a-hurry approach; it's hard for me to know what is good progress or otherwise as this is my first go-round on serious training and I am learning from books, videos, dvd's and TV. We did do the basic obedience class thing, but in a class/group setting you don't get alot of chances for individual feedback from the leader. But, thanks for the encouragement- it really helps having so many informed and supportive people here on the forum to help with questions and concerns.
It doesn't seem like it's only been six months, for some reason- so I guess I should just relax and be happy for what we have accomplished so far! :) There is a local training club that I want us to join, but I am going to be traveling ALOT for work in the next few months so don't want to commit to it right now as I won't be here most weeknights when most of the classes are held. But that is something to look forward to, and in the meantime there's plenty we can work on towards that CGC! :D

[Big Dogs]

just a question jelly when you are sitting your dog to shake hands are you also using the stay command?

[jelly8bean]

Yes, kind of. When starting out we were just taught to use the sit/stay command, shake hands, release the stay and then briskly walk away. Now that my dog has gone further in obedience, I do expect her to hold the sit till I tell her to do otherwise without the specific stay command. Especially if it is next to me in the traditional heel position.

[RKCM]

Thanks for this information. I just assumed they had to be a year old.

[Big Dogs]

Thanks for the clarification jelly, every trainer has there own way of doing things and I was just Curious I teach a little different but all that matters is the end result which it sounds like you have achieved. Good for you!

[Dobs4ever]

SnuzerDog - good job. Sounds like you are handling it super. Unfortunatley the problem was the other dog, but had one of our Dobermans reacted you can be sure the Doberman on lead under control would be blamed. We live in a crazy society that no longer has an understanding of the bond between man and dog. People who live in the city for the most part have not experienced the animals up close and personal so it has been easy for them to buy into the lies and misinformation spouted by PETA and HSUS.

Keep up the good work and we are all here to help each other.

[RKCM]

I took a couple of obedience classes with my male and he has a CGC. I decided to skip the obedience class this sesscion until summer. I put him in Rally classes because I thought he was a little bored and it would be new. He stays, sits, and does everything, except automatically sit. He will sit when I tell him but to get his CD I understand you can't talk to them or tell them to sit. And his sit is correct on lead, but take him off lead and it isn't just right. Any suggestions?

What I thought of doing is just keep him on lead and push him down, treat, and just do it over and over again. I have to admit my training has been once at week at the training center and not that much at home. This is why I delayed the obedience classes till summer and school is out.

I'm having fun and the dog loves it, but I'm thinking I need to get serious about training him for competition.

[Big Dogs]

RKCM when you are on leash with him does he pull or surge ahead on you when healing or is he right at your hip? My next question is he looking at you while on leash or at least keeping track of you through is side vision? There is no real short cut for investing time you are well on your way to being there you just have to invest the time and a trainer would probably be able to help along.

[RKCM]

We joined an obedience club and he trains there. The trainer has finished dobies in obedience etc. I haven't done enough training at home or he would have advanced quicker, I'm sure. We got him at 2 when he was returned to his breeder. The prior owner went to Iraqi. And I have to say the other owner had him trained for him but the dog knew I was a little person and pulled me all over. He also had a few very bad habits which is corrected. (bad sit, not staying, pulling on lead, etc.) He doesn't do that now. I have the right collar and he is great at walking at my pace now. He just needs practice with finishing and automatic sit.

I never knew obedience was so much fun. I'm a converted toy person and only showed in confirmation with them. The dog really enjoys it and it's fun for me. More training is needed on me, than on the dog. LOL.

Thanks for the reply.

Becky

[Big Dogs]

It sounds as if you both are on the right track and I think you will find that the whole obedience thing is addictive once you start on the path and see results your hooked. Dobes will test you to find out how you rate as a leader and they have what my wife likes to call the knuckle head syndrome ( being stubborn ) which is really rewarding when you work through it. Congratulations nice looking boy!

[SnuzerDog]

I might be doing this backwards, but I have been training my automatic sits for a couple months now, and we've only done the very basic PetsMart obedience class. I have found the clicker training method to work very well for this, especially for 'shaping' the behavior- getting it 'fine-tuned'- the way I understand it. For example, right now when I am walking Deano and I come to a sudden stop, one of the following responses will occur:

- he will immediately sit next to my left leg, almost touching- click and Big Rewards for this; currently about 50% of the time.
- he will sit a bit in front of me (no click), then move back to my left side as above- click and Big Rewards; currently about 30% of time.
- he will sit after a couple seconds, any location- no click, I shuffle backwards a foot or two; if he then comes to sit I click and Normal Reward, or start walking for about 5 seconds, stop again and see what happens; currently about 15% of time.
- he won't sit at all- usually seems distracted by something- wait a few seconds and start walking again, try again in a bit; currently about 5% of time.

I don't prompt in any way, with the exception of the occasional shuffle, but I am eliminating that now as well. I've also started making a game of when he is allowed to start walking from the sit- he is not supposed to get up until I release him with an 'OK, let's go!'- so I try to fake him out, walk around behind him, wait him out, etc. Last night also tried adding slight pressure on the leash- see if I can get him to resist until I release... he was a bit confused at first, but seems to be catching on. Could be fun to make it a tug-o-war... :D

[jelly8bean]

Excellent Snuzer. Sounds great. I wouldn't make it too hard on the leash pulling or tug games. You might want to save tug for incentive when you move up to agility etc. I love the faking out though and will start doing that with Indigo when we get back in the swing of things. My rottie is very laid back and has no real drive so stay is her best thing and I just have to be sure she stays sitting vs laying down... LOL

[Dobs4ever]

Automatic sit - interesting discussion. I guess since I do competition I want an automatic sit to be just that. I can't tell you how many times I see the obedience routine and not once does the dog sit when the person stops. This is big points off I can't afford to loose. I like clicker training for some things but not this because you only click if the dog does it right and I understand the philosophy that the dog will eventually get the idea. I guess I am just more impatient and I want it absolutely clear to the dog that when I stop he sits. I know that when you go into the ring things change because of new location, nervous (yours and the dogs) so the more I can load the deck in my favor the better.

So Watch your p's and q's. In other words if the dog knows sit then from now on I would only work on sit by my side and sit every single time I stop. I would not therefore give the dog the option to sit or not. I want a sit so I will ask for a sit every single time and correct immediatley if I dont' get it.

I don't want any question in the dogs mind of what I want. Try to establish a routine or set up for the sit. Ex. You are heeling and the judge calls for a halt take 2 or 3 slow smaller steps and stop - observe which leg you are stopping on as the dog will take a big cue from this so always stop on the same leg if possible. For me when I am going to sit I slow down for a couple steps to alert the dog that things will be changing. Then I stop on my left foot so the dog sees that if my left leg does not proceed past my right leg I will be stopping. As my left leg comes up beside my right foot I do a small stomp in the beginning to cue the dog and I say sit while I lift up slightly on the leash. Dog sits i reward. No questions, no opportunity for the dog to do anything else. I have learned a lot of this from being told to teach one thing and then find out later you have to correct it to get something else so now I just ask for what I want for the beginning. Much less confusing for the dog. That is how you get an automiatic sit even in the ring. I get so frustrated when people say I can't believe he didn't sit - He knows sit. NO HE DOES NOT or he would have SAT. Sorry that is just one of my pet peeves.

[Big Dogs]

SnuzerDog here's a couple of things to remember when you are training Deano. And bear with me if you already know these. When working from a sit use the command heal and always take your first step with your left foot this let's the dog see and hear that it is ok to advance. I would not use the word ok to have him advance and heal with you as this can become confusing for the dog since we tend to tell them ok for alought of other things we do with them in every day life. I'f you want to walk around him from the sit position and have him remain seated start of with your right foot he will pick up on this visual Que rather quickly through repetition. If you want to release him from the sit position which is always a good position to release from use the word free as this will let him know he is done training. The repetition of starting and stopping is an excellent way to get his attention and keep it. I wouldn't pull on the leash in front of him to see if he will release his position because this could be come confusing to him also. If you want to make a game of it have some one create a distraction for him other than you using his toys or even a treat as he should be looking for you for a release command. I like to play with the dog after working with them so that it is always a positive experience. Also one thing to remember is if you are going to use the stay command, stay commands should be 3min or more now you will have to work up to that but that is one of the big differences between sit and stay. Hope this helps and it sounds like you are well on your way. Good luck and enjoy! Oh one last thing Dobes4ever is right if you give him a command to sit it is not an option do not advance with him see it through, make him sit up on the leash and if you take 3 fingers one on each side of the tail and one on top you can make any dog sit , there are pressure points at this location and it doesn't hurt them it just gives them the sensation to sit.

[SnuzerDog]

Thanks to all for the advice on this; Big Dogs, I am still in my first year with Deano and dog training so all points are taken gladly!
Sorry not to respond sooner, as I mentioned somewhere else I'm recovering from several intense weeks of work and work/travel so am still catching up with threads.
I am still mixing up the contexts and environments in practicing Deano on his automatic sits, but have dropped the 'tugging' as I agree it could easily be confusing. I am blessed that in our urban environment almost every evening walk offers some sort of new distraction to practice focusing through, or a chance to perform better at a one that's not so new. Tonight it was an out of control dog being walked (really dragged and throttled) on the other side of the road; night before, a homeless man on a bench; various loud traffic noises nearly every night. Also, after transitioning through a varied reward routine with the clicker I'm now varying rewards totally without the clicker. Haven't quite decided what to train next, kind of in a rut doing what we do! Going to get my head back in these threads and my books for ideas! Really want to get the membership in the training club I've picked out, but I am going to be traveling during the week much of the summer and fall and won't be able to make the class schedule, so that will have to wait for a bit.:(

But, with all the help I get from you all I guess it's not such a big problem! :)

[Dobs4ever]

One of the most important things to rememeber in the CGC test is you can talk to your dog all the way through. This is very important and helps the dog stay more focused on you. So when you meet the friendly stranger you should be watching your dog and talk like you are talking to the dog. I ask the dog to sit - as he sits I take a quick glancd to see where the person is to shake hand and quickly look back at my dog to make sure he is not trying to move or get close to the other dog. This really helps a young dog focus on you.

If you loose sight of the dog the dog looses focus on what he is suppose to be doing. So help them by talking to them and keeping them engaged with you. It also helps you relax since you have to focus on the dog.

[tidibole]

In order for a dog to test for a CGC, he must be old enough to recieve a Rabies shot, which is generally 4 to 6 months. Hope I wasn't redundant with this reply as I did not read the entire thread.

[RKCM]

We were required to get a CGC to do therapy visits etc. It also is good for the public to see dobermans in therapy, helping people......especially with all the dog legislation proposals and Peta.

[tidibole]

just a question jelly when you are sitting your dog to shake hands are you also using the stay command?When I tested the sit was an implied STAY command as I made no effort to move forward. I stopped, he sat, I shook hands, the dog stayed in the SIT position and did not move until I moved my LEFT leg..and preceeded!!!!

[tidibole]

We were required to get a CGC to do therapy visits etc. It also is good for the public to see dobermans in therapy, helping people......especially with all the dog legislation proposals and Peta.I also had a rescue that had a CGC and then TDI....The toughest for him was to leave all of the "goodies" that ended up on the ground during testing. He was truly a CHOW HOUND!!!!and made no qualms about it...

[Dobs4ever]

Jelly - usually a dog doing a CGC is not trained to the level where I would expect him to sit and stay so you can certianly use a stay if you want, but it is most important to just remember to watch you dog and encourage your dog all the way around. After all this is the first time he has been in the ring situation most likely and he is not sure what is going on. Remember you have changed the circumstances so it looks different to him and he will need this encouragement.

Certainly by the time you are at CD or BH level you dog should sit and stay in position until given another command or released. But again this is entry level obedience so the dog IMO is usually not 100% proofed. Fact is they goof up. Gunner is so good - when he messes up it is BECAUSE I MISCUED HIM> or he is just so excited to work he gets ahead of himself. They are so smart it is hard to keep them contained - Gunner LOVES to show off and he LOVES to go ahead of me to show ME he KNOWS what is coming next. So for him I never work a routine in any order until the day we are in the ring. It is the best I can do to keep him off guard.

[tidibole]

Sorry dobs4ever, have to disagree. Walking by your side and sitting upon stopping is an integral part of any type of obedience training or just that of a pleasant dog to walk. It is just a given if you know what you want as the end result, whether in competiton or just plain companion walking. I think anyone interested in a CGC will have the ultimate interpratation of what is required and a sit and stay is necessary.

[Cotto]

My resued Dobe, Sydney, passed the CGC. They offered a combo deal to take the TDI on the same day and he passed. I found the TDI was just a continuation of sort of the CGC. It tests your dogs manners and temperament towards you, others and dogs in various scenarios that simulate encounters you are likely to have. It just shows your dog will walk politely, not behave impolitely towards strange people and dogs and that your dog knows and listens to basic commands without correction. It was rewarding for both dog and me to pass the test and has encouraged us to continue working. I will never compete my dog as he is just a house pet but it is very important to me that he knows his place and respects me, my guests and strangers that I accept. He still needs work on recalls with distraction and I will probably do a few private lessons for specific issues I want to address but overall, basic obedience transformed him from a timid dog that didn't do well with other dogs to a dog I can trust with ANY dog, even the ones he doesn't like. I can now allow him to play with any dog, big or small, with no fear of him biting. He is a joy to walk and I let the neighborhood kids pet him on walks. He is great with small kids and babies. This is the result of many supervised interactions, a lot of exposure, change in my energy (not transmitting my own fears to him) and participation in classes. He is now a well behaved member of society and that is something I am proud of.

[Dobs4ever]

And you should be very proud. You have given the dog the confidence he lacked and have given him a much happier life. It can't be fun living in fear of strange things. It does become addictive diesn't it!!!!!

[Big Dogs]

Congratulations coto to you and sydney you two sound like a great team and you should be proud of your accomplishments. This is a message that I hope everyone reads that given time and hard work not only have you transformed a dog into a great example but you also learned things and gained confidence. This is what training is all about.

[Kaspar]

I know it all depends on the dog but what age is everyones dobe when they got the CGC?

[RKCM]

Congratulations coto to you and sydney you two sound like a great team and you should be proud of your accomplishments. This is a message that I hope everyone reads that given time and hard work not only have you transformed a dog into a great example but you also learned things and gained confidence. This is what training is all about.

You said it just right! Congrads.

[RKCM]

Rereading old threads. I was just wondering if anyone has a new CGC. If not, I encourage you to give it a try. It doesn't take much training and most dogs would pass if they can do basic obedience and have some manners. 4ever, an evaluator, may disagree or have other suggestions.

Most of you would agree it is a very good thing to do with your dog to show that our dogs can be good citizens. So many times the public at large do not see our breed in this light. Part of owning a doberman, sometimes means proving they aren't dangerous and can be taken in public etc. So sad the way they are perceived sometimes.

Big Hair Do has never went to obedience or been tested. She was just so easy to train that I never enrolled her in classes. I think she has enough manners to pass. Will test her this year. She is jealous of all her friends holding that certificate and wants one too. LOL....

Does anyone have a CGC? New or old?

[sazzafraz]

Any dog that has been trained for BASIC house manners should be able to accompolish a CGC......It is NOT competiton obedience!!!!

[sazzafraz]

Rereading old threads. I was just wondering if anyone has a new CGC. If not, I encourage you to give it a try. It doesn't take much training and most dogs would pass if they can do basic obedience and have some manners. 4ever, an evaluator, may disagree or have other suggestions.

Most of you would agree it is a very good thing to do with your dog to show that our dogs can be good citizens. So many times the public at large do not see our breed in this light. Part of owning a doberman, sometimes means proving they aren't dangerous and can be taken in public etc. So sad the way they are perceived sometimes.

Big Hair Do has never went to obedience or been tested. She was just so easy to train that I never enrolled her in classes. I think she has enough manners to pass. Will test her this year. She is jealous of all her friends holding that certificate and wants one too. LOL....

Does anyone have a CGC? New or old? LOL...I believe is "KUDO!"!! but same difference!!!!

[sazzafraz]

A CGC cerrtification is an certificiate to attain assuming that you have a WELL mannered/behaved dog to begin with!!! The qualifiacations will vary with the instructors, depending on their requirements... I have taken classes that have been HARD and those that I would not have a passed a dog if it just stood still!!! I prefer the classes that crcoss over to TDI....You really know what the dog is made of and your own abilities!!!!

[RKCM]

Any dog that has been trained for BASIC house manners should be able to accompolish a CGC......It is NOT competiton obedience!!!!

Certainly not competition, but it does show that our dogs are good citizens and shows our dogs in a good light to the public. This is important with all the breed specific legislation. IT's a good thing to do with your dog.

[sazzafraz]

Certainly not competition, but it does show that our dogs are good citizens and shows our dogs in a good light to the public. This is important with all the breed pacific legislation. IT's a good thing to do with your dog.Certainly aplogize if you miss interrupeted my repy...there is a TREMENDOUS difference between CGC and CD.... BUT the main issue is a WELL trained companion...The difference is the 1/2 pts for perfection!!!!

[SnuzerDog]

As a matter of fact, CGC is our goal for the next few weeks!

I don't know that I posted this anywhere else, but Deano graduated his Beginner's Obedience class at the Columbus All Breed Club in first place out of 12 other dogs back on 3/2! I was (and still am :p) very proud of him for this accomplishment. For a rescue dog who was afraid of his own shadow and had no trust for humans two years ago, to a well socialized, gentle, laid back, easy to train companion- while I wouldn't have thought it possible when we got him, it has been so fulfilling and I've enjoyed it so much it amazes me.

So, at any rate, after you complete the public Beginners course, and have the signature of two Club members, you can apply for membership which gives you access to ALOT of more advanced courses. I was just at the new member orientation meeting for the club last evening getting all the details and info, and our next course is going to be Advanced Beginners Obedience, which basically focuses on solidification of beginners commands while adding a few nuances and alternate methods, including CGC required behaviors. The Club does CGC certification a few times a year, so I hope to get into the next 8-week class and then take the test the next time it is offered.

Here is a link to the club's really nice website for anyone who is curious:
http://www.columbusallbreed.com/index.php

Looking forward to it, I will post back some of our experiences when we get started! :)

[RKCM]

Snuzer, that is great. We are so proud of you and your dog. It is nice to hear about what our breed is doing, especially from members. Many more....

[Dobs4ever]

SnuzerDog - the CGC is a great starting place and can set you well on your way if you choose to go further. We will all be pulling for you and can't wait to hear how you do.

For anyone who might be near the Warresnburg, MO area on May 14 I will be conducting a CGC certification at the Warrensburg, MO Fairgrounds. The CGC is being held by the American Sports Dog Registry.